An annoying brother and other not so deep thoughts

Chat and sip. Beret optional.

Moderator: Ginny

Scot
Tengster
Posts: 1673
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 4:21 am
Location: Hilo, HI
Contact:

An annoying brother and other not so deep thoughts

Postby Scot » Fri Aug 27, 2010 8:34 am

At one of the recent Yoshi's shows, my brother (whom I took to one show, another brother to the other, and my Mom to two others) was both trying to annoy me and find out why I would attend so many (only 20 or so, at the time) Vienna concerts, so asked me how Vienna's music made me feel. Well, I think he only partially succeeded at one of his two missions because I didn't have a good answer for him at the time. Sitting in the Würselen show, however, I finally came up with one.

Vienna's music helps me feel.

Period.

I know that's not much for most of you, but for an enneagram type 3 (http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/TypeThree.asp), it's a pretty monumental revelation. ;)

s
My little attempt at a Vienna Teng WWW page (Set lists, song info., and more...)

Walking Stranger
Getting Stranger
Posts: 363
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2007 4:57 pm

Postby Walking Stranger » Fri Aug 27, 2010 4:58 pm

Hi Scot,

Just tell them it's about more than a friendship relation with VT, that she's like a sister to you...
♡ Internet/Drugs/Seeds. Copy=Right. ACTA harms freedom. Stop ACTA!Please copy and share. Say NO to ACTA.

aaparallel
Getting Stranger
Posts: 397
Joined: Fri Aug 14, 2009 7:19 am
Location: San Jose, CA
Contact:

Postby aaparallel » Fri Aug 27, 2010 5:49 pm

Walking Stranger wrote:Just tell them it's about more than a friendship relation with VT, that she's like a sister to you...


Scot, VT did call you a "good friend" at that one show... :wink:
"Drowning my pain in lemonade. . . Singing along to 'feelin' alright'"

Scot
Tengster
Posts: 1673
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 4:21 am
Location: Hilo, HI
Contact:

Postby Scot » Fri Aug 27, 2010 9:09 pm

aaparallel wrote:
Walking Stranger wrote:Just tell them it's about more than a friendship relation with VT, that she's like a sister to you...


Scot, VT did call you a "good friend" at that one show... :wink:


Well- she was of course being exceptionally generous, but yes, you two did hit upon an additional facet of (presumably) our appreciation of Vienna and her music and that is her and her supporting casts' approachability and nature as genuinely nice, great, and interesting people. Of course, that doesn't say anything specifically about how the music makes me feel, but it is a part of why I like to attend so many shows. In general, I've gotten to know most of the musicians whom I've seen multiple times (the Dead, probably being the main exception) and it certainly is part of the equation - if the musicians are jerks, I'm less likely go out of my way, or even want to, see them perform.

To insert another enneagram reference, my 4-wing appreciates the artistic outlook on life even though my dominant 3 strives to remain objective.

s
My little attempt at a Vienna Teng WWW page (Set lists, song info., and more...)

Ang Mo
Tengster
Posts: 1661
Joined: Sun May 16, 2004 11:17 pm

Postby Ang Mo » Sat Aug 28, 2010 2:24 am

Well Scot, if you ever have the opportunity to watch Swamp People on the History Channel, you will embrace your annoying brother and tell him you feel happy you and your tribe do not live in a swamp and that you have the wonderful opportunity to experience the joy of a Vienna Teng concert. On a side bar if you ever discover a new galaxy I want you to name it the Vienna Galaxy, or if you discover a new planet, call it Tengster. That is what I would request in my Mo Universe :lol:
--the only adults who are never depressed: chuckleheads, California surfers, and fundamentalist Christians who believe they have had a personal encounter with Jesus and are saved once and for all. Would you trade your depression to become any of these?

Scot
Tengster
Posts: 1673
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 4:21 am
Location: Hilo, HI
Contact:

Postby Scot » Sat Aug 28, 2010 6:58 am

Ang Mo wrote: On a side bar if you ever discover a new galaxy I want you to name it the Vienna Galaxy, or if you discover a new planet, call it Tengster. That is what I would request in my Mo Universe :lol:


I recently found out that my wife and I get are geting asteroids named after us. If I get two more (the daughter would have to come first :), I'll consider a Vienna tribute!

s
My little attempt at a Vienna Teng WWW page (Set lists, song info., and more...)

Ang Mo
Tengster
Posts: 1661
Joined: Sun May 16, 2004 11:17 pm

Postby Ang Mo » Sun Aug 29, 2010 5:02 am

WoW!!! His and Hers Asteroids! Pretty cool! Today I felt like I was on a foreign planet. I was hiking in the Owyhees, which is so remote that it is 1 person per 100 square miles or something like that. I did see the largest Pronghorn Antelope I have ever seen. Took off like a rocket when I got to close. I wish I could run that fast.
--the only adults who are never depressed: chuckleheads, California surfers, and fundamentalist Christians who believe they have had a personal encounter with Jesus and are saved once and for all. Would you trade your depression to become any of these?

Fred
Tengster
Posts: 767
Joined: Sat Jul 05, 2008 1:55 am
Location: NY metro area

Postby Fred » Sun Aug 29, 2010 7:09 pm

Scot wrote:In general, I've gotten to know most of the musicians whom I've seen multiple times (the Dead, probably being the main exception) and it certainly is part of the equation...

Scot, that must be great, and must certainly add to your experience of music. I can't claim to know any of the musicians whose music I admire (for instance I've spoken with Vienna 3 times for an aggregate of maybe 2 minutes, on the level of "Great concert!" "Thanks for coming."), but I have to agree with you anyway. One hopes that singer-songwriters who write seemingly heartfelt, topical lyrics reveal their true selves in them; otherwise, where do the lyrics come from? So I'm comfortable with the thought that I understand the world view of a Jackson Browne or an Ani DiFranco or a Bruce Springsteen, without ever having spoken a word to them, and I think that if I knew them personally I'd consider them admirable people (realizing that in the real world one can be admirable and have flaws). They are also celebrities whose public actions, causes they support, etc., are consistent with their music, which is reassuring. While Vienna's lyrics are less often overtly social/political than theirs are, they still seem to reveal an author with deep concern for other people, which to me is the sine qua non of a good person. And while she isn't in the public eye to the same extent that they are, she chooses to reveal her thoughts through social media, and the fact that the Vienna I "know" through her journal is the same one I "know" through her lyrics reassures me that they are both most likely real.

I guess the question is, why does it matter? Can't the art stand on its own? After all, one can enjoy a Wagner opera without liking Wagner, who is, after all, no longer personally knowable (and by all accounts was detestable while he as alive). I don't really have an answer; I can just say that the fact that I *think* I would admire Vienna personally if I knew her (even if I didn't agree with her on everything--I suspect my politics are a bit left of hers) does influence my appreciation of her music. Can't say why.

Going way off-topic now, but the previous issue reminded me of this. No matter how revealing their lyrics or public statements, most songwriters and performers need to maintain a boundary between those things and their personal life, probably just to stay sane, so you can't *really* know them without knowing them. Certainly true of Vienna. However, I saw one earlier this year who pretty much blew that boundary away: Janis Ian. She was touring in support of her autobiography rather than a new album, and she recited/performed/commented on passages of it as her patter between songs. Maybe it's because she's been "public" forever (she was on the cover of Time magazine when she was 15), maybe she's just like that (one of her lyrics goes, "I've led a fascinating life, I've had a husband and a wife...") but she basically presented herself and her music as a single package that night. It was pretty amazing. And afterward, during the little postage stamp of time one gets during a CD signing, I watched as she turned every fan compliment around 180 degrees, and had a conversation about the fan (myself included). It was obviously a learned skill, but as we know in the professional education biz, what you do over and over eventually becomes who you are. You really did feel like you knew her afterward, and that she knew you, too. I'm not suggesting this kind of high-wire act for every performer. Janis must have spent enormous time in therapy or on Zen retreats, or something, to be able to do this. Plus she's been performing for something like 50 years. I'm just saying that I went to a concert not expecting much and had a totally unique experience. I'd go back to see her again anytime. And it didn't even have all that much to do with the music. Not surprising that for an artist who hardly makes new music anymore, and doesn't tour all that much, she's got a really active online fan community.
Ain't praying for miracles, I'm just down on my knees
Listening for the song behind everything I think I know
And everything I think I know is just static on the radio.

Scot
Tengster
Posts: 1673
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 4:21 am
Location: Hilo, HI
Contact:

Postby Scot » Mon Aug 30, 2010 10:17 am

Hi Fred,

Fred wrote:
Scot wrote:In general, I've gotten to know most of the musicians whom I've seen multiple times (the Dead, probably being the main exception) and it certainly is part of the equation...

Scot, that must be great, and must certainly add to your experience of music. I can't claim to know any of the musicians whose music I admire (for instance I've spoken with Vienna 3 times for an aggregate of maybe 2 minutes, on the level of "Great concert!" "Thanks for coming."), but I have to agree with you anyway.


Well, on further reflection, I guess I should have said "several, or many" instead of "most", but in any case ...

One hopes that singer-songwriters who write seemingly heartfelt, topical lyrics reveal their true selves in them; otherwise, where do the lyrics come from? So I'm comfortable with the thought that I understand the world view of a Jackson Browne or an Ani DiFranco or a Bruce Springsteen, without ever having spoken a word to them, and I think that if I knew them personally I'd consider them admirable people (realizing that in the real world one can be admirable and have flaws). They are also celebrities whose public actions, causes they support, etc., are consistent with their music, which is reassuring. While Vienna's lyrics are less often overtly social/political than theirs are, they still seem to reveal an author with deep concern for other people, which to me is the sine qua non of a good person. And while she isn't in the public eye to the same extent that they are, she chooses to reveal her thoughts through social media, and the fact that the Vienna I "know" through her journal is the same one I "know" through her lyrics reassures me that they are both most likely real.

I guess the question is, why does it matter? Can't the art stand on its own?


I think the answer here is clearly yes, but what distinguishes a musician I like vs. one I may cross two oceans to see is that something extra- that sense of an emotional and/or personal connection - be it through seemingly heartfelt lyrics, personal stories, or personal acquaintance. That Vienna, for example, excels in all three of these example areas is pretty unique and quite amazing.


After all, one can enjoy a Wagner opera without liking Wagner, who is, after all, no longer personally knowable (and by all accounts was detestable while he as alive). I don't really have an answer; I can just say that the fact that I *think* I would admire Vienna personally if I knew her (even if I didn't agree with her on everything--I suspect my politics are a bit left of hers) does influence my appreciation of her music. Can't say why.

Going way off-topic now, but the previous issue reminded me of this. No matter how revealing their lyrics or public statements, most songwriters and performers need to maintain a boundary between those things and their personal life, probably just to stay sane, so you can't *really* know them without knowing them. Certainly true of Vienna. However, I saw one earlier this year who pretty much blew that boundary away: Janis Ian. She was touring in support of her autobiography rather than a new album, and she recited/performed/commented on passages of it as her patter between songs. Maybe it's because she's been "public" forever (she was on the cover of Time magazine when she was 15), maybe she's just like that (one of her lyrics goes, "I've led a fascinating life, I've had a husband and a wife...") but she basically presented herself and her music as a single package that night. It was pretty amazing. And afterward, during the little postage stamp of time one gets during a CD signing, I watched as she turned every fan compliment around 180 degrees, and had a conversation about the fan (myself included). It was obviously a learned skill, but as we know in the professional education biz, what you do over and over eventually becomes who you are. You really did feel like you knew her afterward, and that she knew you, too. I'm not suggesting this kind of high-wire act for every performer. Janis must have spent enormous time in therapy or on Zen retreats, or something, to be able to do this. Plus she's been performing for something like 50 years. I'm just saying that I went to a concert not expecting much and had a totally unique experience. I'd go back to see her again anytime. And it didn't even have all that much to do with the music. Not surprising that for an artist who hardly makes new music anymore, and doesn't tour all that much, she's got a really active online fan community.


I've heard good things about Janis Ian, but this tops the cake. Thanks for that. :)

scot
My little attempt at a Vienna Teng WWW page (Set lists, song info., and more...)

Fred
Tengster
Posts: 767
Joined: Sat Jul 05, 2008 1:55 am
Location: NY metro area

Postby Fred » Tue Aug 31, 2010 2:00 am

Scot wrote:I've heard good things about Janis Ian, but this tops the cake. Thanks for that.

Don't go to see her expecting a Vienna concert, though. Although the degree of communication Janis achieved in her act was pretty amazing, I left just feeling good & kind of uplifted. (Had she done her big emo number, Stars, her music itself might have had more impact on me.) In contrast, I left Vienna's show at the Highline week before last feeling almost dazed from the impact. If I hadn't gone to a Joan Osborne concert 2 days later, which kind of pushed my musical reset button, I might still be feeling that way.
Ain't praying for miracles, I'm just down on my knees
Listening for the song behind everything I think I know
And everything I think I know is just static on the radio.


Return to “The Cafe”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Baidu [Spider] and 2 guests